[grole]

This post doesn't really belong in my Trog although it is directly related to this post in the trog.

Whilst at a session with Johan (crossfit holland), we included some burpees to count towards days 16 & 17 of the burpee challenge. After the first 10 Johan stopped me and we had a discussion.

The basic gist of the discussion was that I was not doing the push up part with proper form. ie Not full range, chest to ground (before belly) with a tight core. He quite correctly stated that I struggle to do more than 1-3 consecutive push ups with good form and that I should not have started the burpee challenge without having mastered the basic push up.

The issue (which I have mentioned previously in my trog), is that my ability to lift my bodyweight is still lacking.

During the discussion my instinctive and somewhat rebellious reaction was to think to myself, 'well I am going to continue with the challenge, even with bad form it is going to be better than not doing the challenge".

With a bit of time to reflect on this I have decided to compromise between Johan's correct assertion and my pig headedness.

I am going to continue with the challenge, but do the burpees without the push ups. Admittedly it will feel like I have lessened the achievement when I get to day 100, but at least I won't be programming in bad push ups into my 'muscle memory' / central nervous system.

At the same time I am going to have to tackle the primary problem, which is my strength. I guess it is time to go back to basics, rethink my goals and target my training towards those goals.

So this topic is going to be where I inflict my thoughts goals and plans on anyone else who actually manages to read this far into what seems to be turning in to a rather long post.

[grole]

Primary (nebulous) goal : Increase my strength

Specific goal 1 :

Develop my strength to the point where I can push or pull my bodyweight in a vertical axis through an appropriate full range of movement.

Sub goals - In no particular order

Goal 1a : 10 consecutive push ups with good form.

Goal 1b : 5 consecutive dead hang pull ups.

Goal 1c: Bodyweight deadlift. Completed 8/11/08
Goal 1c : 1.5 x bodyweight deadlift. Completed 31/01/10
Goal 1c: 2 x bodyweight deadlift.

Goal 1d : Bodyweight squat (not being specific about OHS, BS, FS at this moment in time)3x100kg back squat 05/08/09
Goal 1d: 1.5 x bodyweight back squat.

Goal 1e : Bodyweight clean

Goal 1f : Bodyweight push press.

Plan

Goal 1a: GTG with push ups and generally include push ups into as many workouts as possible.
Goal 1b: GTG with pull ups and generally include pull ups into as many workouts as possible.

Goals 1c-f: Lift heavy from the ground every week. (a la bear complex, but lower reps).

In utrecht : I have a standard bar & weights, but no racks. So I will have to take the weight from ground. The sequence used in the bear complex looks a good starting point to me. Increase weight each week.

In the UK: I don't have any weights, so I will have to work with the sandbag and keg. Some experimentation may be needed there.
Moved back to UK full time Jan 09. Now have builders trestles to use as poor mans squat racks.
Currently following Stronglifts 5x5

This post has been edited by grole: 01 February 2010 - 01:08 PM

[grole]

Goal 2 (secondary) : Improve my conditioning

TBD. I still need to get work on this and figure out what my specific goals are.

I am currently thinking along the lines of

Tabata Burpees
Magic 50
Ross's EIT and GPP workouts.

Plan

Continue with burpee challenge (no push ups)
Mix in Ross type EIT or GPP days with strength days.

[grole]

Goal 3 (secondary) : Continue with Martial arts training

Specifics

Go back to regular Tai Chi training with Carl while in the UK.

Continue with Thai boxing (discuss with Carl first) while in the Netherlands.

[grole]

Goal 4 (tertiary): Improve flexibility / mobility

Not going to set a specific goal here at this moment in time. Basically putting it in as a marker.

Going to continue with the Maxwell daily dozen, and roll in some additional stretching over time.

[grole]

Goal 5 (tertiary) : Develop balance and strength through gymnastic progressions

Goal 5a : Progress towards freestanding handstand

- Work up to 60s frog stand

Goal 5b : Progress towards planche

- Work up to 60s frog stand

Goal 5c : Progress towards front lever

- Work towards 60s tuck front lever

[grole]

Now for my outline training plan.

Daily
Maxwell's Daily Dozen
Burpees for FCUK 100 day burpee challenge. Without push ups

GTG : Push ups
GTG : Pull ups

Weekly

4-5 workouts per week

Alternating strength workouts with conditioning + core workouts (along the lines of Never Gymless 50 day sample plan)

Crossfit Holland, Tai Chi or Thai boxing sessions >= 1hr = 1 workout

Either substitute for conditioning or strength workout or insert as an extra workout

Lift heavy at least once per week

Practice gymnastic progressions 3 x per week.

Sample Strength workouts

1)
3 rounds of 3 sets of bear complex - Increase weight each week, back off on failure.
3 rounds of 5 deadlifts - Increase weight each week, back off on failure

2)
Any Ross Emanait strength based workout (NG Beginners or 50 day)
or any strength based CF WOD

Conditioning / Core

Any conditioning/core set from NG, II, FTC or a Crossfit WOD
Anything I see online that looks 'fun'

[Paul]

Excellent thread... you've really put some great thought into this.. not just in observing what's wrong but great steps towards understanding what is needed to rectify the problems and move forwards.

Good luck with this.

[grole]

Cheers Paul

[Johny Cash]

Grole do you have any of Ross' books as many of his workout involve push-ups and pulls.

[grole]

Johny Cash, on Sep 7 2008, 03:58 PM, said:

Grole do you have any of Ross' books as many of his workout involve push-ups and pulls.

Johny

Yep, I have the three current books/DVD (NG, II & FTC).

My training plan is basically going to be along the lines of the Never Gymless 50 day plan. With some lifting days added and a little bit of variation coming from sessions with Crossfit Holland sessionm, Tai Chi and Thai boxing lessons.

On top of that I am going to be mixing in some ring work and odd shape lifting (keg/sandbag), some warior challenges from II, gymnastics progressions from Gymnastic Bodies and the odd bit of anything else that takes my fancy when I workout.

My default workout if I don't decide to do anything else will probably be the next workout in the Never Gymless 50 day plan.

[Mark]

Hi grole

Had a read through this post a couple of times now, also had a look at your training logs, right back to page 1.

What I have seen is something that that I think is really common, go to any number of sites that are for people who train, Crossfit, Bodybuilding whatever it maybe and you will always find posts such as yours. The underlying themes being: Frustration - Confusion - Goals, to many or lack of - knowledge, to much or not enough.

You will always find answers to problems such as yours: How do I improve my press-up strength, the answers will inevitably include such things as muscle memory adaptation, central nervous system adaptation, learning new movement patterns, synaptic response of the brain to the movement to be trained. Blah, Blah, blah.

All of it very true, but mostly said to confuse and make you feel as if you need to join that website, buy that book or magazine by so and so with a PhD in waffle.

Getting fit and everything that goes along with it, is not rocket science, the physical effort is huge if you truly want to be above average and I think most people on here want to be.

I have been training seriously for more years than I can remember, coaching since I was 20, I have more qualifications than I can shake a stick at, I also have one of those degrees in waffle.

But above and beyond that only one lesson in the improvement of physical fitness has stayed with me from the day I was told it. The reason it has stayed with me is because it is true and it matters, where as everything else is superfluous to the fact, I don't care about, even as a coach as to whether I will develop a gazillion new synapses if I do this or that, or that the bone mass density will be improved if I dead lift at this % of my bodyweight.

The individual who taught me that lesson when I was 16 was a Physical Training Instructor at the Commando training centre lympstone, he had no interest in scaling etc his theory was simple, zero becomes one, one becomes two and so on, and he was way ahead of Nike, JUST DO IT, if you want to become good at something then you have to do it, thats it, nothing else needs to be looked for, or googled, no amount of books etc will train you to do a press-up, pull-up etc JUST DO IT. And then after all the repetitions it will just click, you will know that what you have done was right.
I firmly believe that, that simple saying "Just do it" is as simple as it gets, don't look for aids or get hung up on the words of the physically gifted few that make things more complicated than it needs to be.

If you want to improve your press-ups, do press-ups, one at a time and one will become two etc.

Look at where you want your fitness to take you, what do you want your body to do? Then Just do it.

The body is the master adapter:

Beast it.
Feed it.
Rest it.

Easy.

Mark

[Paul]

Great post.

[grole]

CrossfitDerby, on Sep 8 2008, 04:37 PM, said:

Hi grole

Had a read through this post a couple of times now, also had a look at your training logs, right back to page 1.

Hi Mark

I really appreciate you taking the time to do this!

Quote

What I have seen is something that that I think is really common, go to any number of sites that are for people who train, Crossfit, Bodybuilding whatever it maybe and you will always find posts such as yours. The underlying themes being: Frustration - Confusion - Goals, to many or lack of - knowledge, to much or not enough.

You will always find answers to problems such as yours: How do I improve my press-up strength, the answers will inevitably include such things as muscle memory adaptation, central nervous system adaptation, learning new movement patterns, synaptic response of the brain to the movement to be trained. Blah, Blah, blah.

All of it very true, but mostly said to confuse and make you feel as if you need to join that website, buy that book or magazine by so and so with a PhD in waffle.

Getting fit and everything that goes along with it, is not rocket science, the physical effort is huge if you truly want to be above average and I think most people on here want to be.

I have been training seriously for more years than I can remember, coaching since I was 20, I have more qualifications than I can shake a stick at, I also have one of those degrees in waffle.

But above and beyond that only one lesson in the improvement of physical fitness has stayed with me from the day I was told it. The reason it has stayed with me is because it is true and it matters, where as everything else is superfluous to the fact, I don't care about, even as a coach as to whether I will develop a gazillion new synapses if I do this or that, or that the bone mass density will be improved if I dead lift at this % of my bodyweight.

The individual who taught me that lesson when I was 16 was a Physical Training Instructor at the Commando training centre lympstone, he had no interest in scaling etc his theory was simple, zero becomes one, one becomes two and so on, and he was way ahead of Nike, JUST DO IT, if you want to become good at something then you have to do it, thats it, nothing else needs to be looked for, or googled, no amount of books etc will train you to do a press-up, pull-up etc JUST DO IT. And then after all the repetitions it will just click, you will know that what you have done was right.
I firmly believe that, that simple saying "Just do it" is as simple as it gets, don't look for aids or get hung up on the words of the physically gifted few that make things more complicated than it needs to be.

If you want to improve your press-ups, do press-ups, one at a time and one will become two etc.

Look at where you want your fitness to take you, what do you want your body to do? Then Just do it.

The body is the master adapter:

Beast it.
Feed it.
Rest it.

Easy.

Mark

Wow. You are right of course.

Does 'Greasing The Groove' count as just doing it?

I think that part of my problem is I keep finding that although I think I am moving forward at a good rate something keeps coming along and reminding me how far I have to go, and that I have not made as much progress as I felt I had. Whether it be a boxing class where I end up doing push ups from my knees, or having Johan (very gently) point out that the push ups in my burpees are crap., the net result is the same.

My problem is not really with my push ups or pull ups, but rather with my lack of strength as evidenced by my inability to do push ups, pull ups or whatever.

I was training without any goals other than the standard 'get fitter' and I am trying to fix that.

The push ups, pull ups, dead lifts etc, are just my means of measuring any improvement (or lack of) I may make.

I want to get stronger and I want to become better at martial arts through specific skill training, better conditioning, better flexibility, balance, coordination, etc. I am going to focus on strength right now because that is what I feel is really holding me back in a lot of ways, but I don't want to lose sight of all those other things. I would also love to live to a ripe old age with all my mental and physical facilities.

Thanks!

Peter

[grole]

grole, on Sep 6 2008, 12:17 PM, said:

Goal 1c: Bodyweight deadlift.

8/11/2008 Completed.

[Mister C]

grole, on Nov 8 2008, 04:48 PM, said:

8/11/2008 Completed.

Congratulations on the DL goal mate, nice one.

[grole]

Cheers Chris

[Will]

Well done, Im glad you achieved one of your goals, keep at it.

[RossMc]

Great thread dude. It's good to establish goals, and recognise faults/room to improve like you have, and be able to check them off as you go along, and reading this makes me appreciate that it's something I should be doing too.

Good luck with it all, man. And well done on the DL!

[grole]

Will, RossMc

Thanks for the encouragement guys. It really does make a difference.

Peter